Jenny: Welcome to another episode of The Life Adventurist podcast. I’m Jenny Holly, your host. And I am so excited because we are still going strong in the chakra series. We just finished with the heart chakra. With the amazing guests we have there, you definitely we’re getting up into those higher chakras now. So this is the first episode of the throat chakra. And so the throat chakra is really just stepping into your voice, your speech, your truth. It’s about articulating your thoughts and ideas. And it’s also not even about how you communicate but what you communicate and even just really getting to the truth and the wisdom of what that is. And a lot of times we get blocked in our throat chakra because if you ever heard anybody saying and talking about finding your voice and finding out who you are, and you know stepping into your power and sharing your story, like a lot of this has to do with the throat chakra. So today I’m so excited to have such an amazing like energetic, powerful guest on Renata Chubb. She is a graphic designer turn art instructor working on stepping into an expressive art therapist role. Probably people pleaser, who believes in speaking straight facing your stuff and learning to cherish the things that make your soul sing, even if others think it’s ridiculous. Hell fucking Yeah. Welcome to the show.
Renata: I love my intro, Jenny. Thank you.
Jenny: I know, like heck yeah. So Alright, so share a little bit more about yourself. But also you have to share something, something adventurous and fun about yourself to
Renata: Something adventurous and fun about myself? Oh, okay. Well, you know what, uh, as I was just gonna say, as I’ve gotten older, I’ve just gotten more, I care less about what other people think. I think I’m tending to move towards just bigger stretches. Like, for example, dancing around your kitchen with music on I know, we all have done it. But do we do it enough? Like, I’m trying to bring more of that into my own life. I’m now in my 50s, and I’m looking to explore dance movement again, which is so weird for me. Like it feels it feels awkward. But as a kid, I did it. I was a ballerina, or whatever until the age of like, 12 or 13. And then it got put aside, right? And then now again, I’m rediscovering in my 50s how much I really miss that kind of free movement in my own body. And what that brings up for me, like in terms of energy, how that moves energy, how that feels less like exercise, and more like just a way to keep flowing and feel lighter in my body. And there’s some beauty in that.
Jenny: I love that. I love that. So talk a little bit more about like, you know, this journey into expressive arts therapy. Love to hear a little more about what that is and what it means.
Renata: Yes, well, expressive arts therapy is it’s an arts based approach to therapy. So meaning taking in movement, taking in words, as you said, words can be, you know, what you’re articulating verbally, it can be what you write down in a journal, it can be poems that you write, it can be songs that you write, it can be stories that you rewrite, you know, we often hear people rewriting their story. That’s the way, that’s a way, that’s a way to sort of work with your own stuff and kind of go you know, I see the story as this. But what if I wrote it like that? You know, what if I took it off on a completely different tangent, expressive arts therapy is also visual art. And its sound I think, we spoke about a bit about singing and drumming, any kind of sound and how that impacts the body and just the, the way it’s a it’s a, it’s a way to get stuff out. Right? If anyone’s ever been to a sound therapist, right? That we all we know that the body and everything is vibration, it’s working with vibration to move, blockages to move things along, to get more of an energetic flow within the body. Right? And singing is huge, like in terms of Throat Chakra. That’s a fantastic way when was the last time you kind of actually started singing and made up a song right? Yes, creative expression in there and the flow of getting something out of your body, right? I mean, people sing in the car, in the shower, hopefully still, right? I mean, I do.
Jenny: Right? Oh, that’s awesome. I have so many questions. But before we like go like down the path because I have like so many things I want to ask and I’m so excited. I really just want to just hear your perspective on the throat chakra like what is it? What does it mean to you? How does it tie into your work?
Renata: Oh, you know what, it’s huge. For me. It’s been a I’ll be honest, a lifelong journey for me. I had a childhood where I was very quiet so I was taught to be quiet and good and nice and all of those things. My father worked in the hotel Business often we go to the hotel for a restaurant to a restaurant, I’d be totally, if I wanted to make noise I’d sit behind the curtains. I was very quiet kid. I had a you know, as most folks, I had a voice, boisterous sibling, so I became the quiet one. So it’s been sort of a lifetime of learning how to be okay, with making noise and having people go, Oh, what’s that noise? You know, like, it’s, it’s a really interesting journey. So once again, I’ve always been drawn to like the creative, the visual arts. And I think, because it’s a way to articulate information or to pass along information without having to say it, I think there’s something in that, for me, I love this concept of being able to work through something and not have to verbalize it all the time. I don’t know why. But that’s the thing for me. And I have found as I’ve gotten older, it’s gotten easier. But there was definitely a phase in my I want to say, late teens to I want to say mid 40s, long time, where I felt restricted, and very cautious about what I put out into the world, you know, creating career and all that, like what are you putting out there be very careful. I think the next generation of the younger generation doesn’t feel that as much but it was like, you know, you’re trying to raise children, you have an older parent, you’ve got a career, you got a spouse, like all these things that you’re trying to, I hate the word manage, but you’re there different relationships, all of them. And then the expectations, the societal expectations, your family expectations, and being able to speak your truth in those experiences, in some cases didn’t go over well.
Jenny: Mm hmm. Yeah, what I love about what you’re talking about, it’s just a different perspective, for therapy and working through your shit. Okay, because we all have shit. We all have baggage, we all have things we all have leveling up to do. And I think, no, I know that. This is so powerful, because there’s a lot of people who have maybe never considered this as a way to do it. Because think about it, right? Just talking about general society, you know, for therapy, people use some kind of advice, whether it be like cigarettes, or drugs, or alcohol, or sex, or food or whatever, like, there’s lots of different things. Or, of course, you know, you can go to a therapist, or you can maybe try to talk it out with your friends or whatever. But at least from what I’ve grown up with, and knowing and being exposed to, I would have never thought of arts or sound or some of this, what you’re talking about coming from this perspective to be a form of therapy. But as you’re saying it I’m like, this is so exciting, because for me, I’m going you know, what, if I got to work through anything, I’d rather paintee, dancer. That sounds so much more fun. Yeah, maybe some of the other ways.
Renata: Yeah. And you can do a lot of it. So you can do some of it on your own, right. I mean, it doesn’t always have to be this, you’ll sit down and tell me the deepest, darkest secret, sometimes you just know, it’s no different than going for a run like that, that the movement of the body, the breath, you know, a releases things, it’s the same idea. And if you sit with an intention and sort of say, okay, you know, for example, I run a painting from the soul series. And, you know, essentially what we do is we sit with each chakra, so let’s take the throat chakra as an example, I would do exactly what you’ve done. Give me a little rundown of what does that mean, you know? And what is that all about? And then ask the students to sort of where in your life do you feel you can’t always say what needs to be said, or you feel, you know, your kind of gut kind of turns and you’re like, Oh, I don’t really want to do that. But I can’t say that, because then someone will be hurt or upset or, and we basically take a class to paint that out. Just paint it, where are you at now, it doesn’t have to be perfect. You’re not looking to create the perfect picture. And we do a little meditation and from that some people might get the imagery of, you know, foghorn. Some people might get the imagery of a mouse, some people might get like, it doesn’t. It doesn’t even matter if you don’t get imagery. It’s just this concept of where are you now with that, like, I feel I’m at, I’m in a great place. It’s taken a lifetime, right? But I feel now I’m in a great place. There is no time in my life where I won’t say where I’m at, honestly, from now on, I’ve done my stint of being nice and worrying about how other people might take it. And now I’m much more like this is I just clarity. It’s all I ever want. I’ll be clear with you, I expect you to be clear with me. And no hard feelings like just honesty, right? Because if people are honest with each other, then you can usually find a way to work together. When somebody is already sort of resenting the experience before they even arrived. It never works well. Right? And I think as we spoke about, like, you know, this is a fabulous way. There’s many ways to do it. But like writing, rewriting a story. So for example you’ve had everyone has trauma in their lives, everyone has not so great experiences. Can you rewrite that story like or when you look to the future, even though the goal is to stay in the present? Work with what you have and where you’re at. When you think of your future, can you write the most fantastic story? Can you just write the most fantastic story and not worry about all the other stuff? Can you just truly let out what you would love to have and do and experience and be? And all of those things without restricting it and putting logic all around it and wrapping it and going well, okay, well, that was a nice idea. But it’ll never like just put it out there and not try to pull it back. Being logical, very childlike, right? That’s a very childlike exercise to me to sort of release all your programming a little bit. So there’s many, many ways to do it. But it is an exciting for I’m excited about it in terms of it being more accessible to people and having less of a stigma around it. Yeah, I bet it may be it becomes normal to dance in the kitchen, when you’re feeling crappy, put on some great music. Even if you don’t feel like it in that moment, by song two or three. You’ve shifted something.
Jenny: Yes, right. Yes, we just gave the students in our next levolution coaching program, we just had them create two different playlists. And one of them was like at GSD get shit done playlist, right? And the other one was kind of like a vibin playlist, right? Sometimes you just need to be vibing. And especially with with Jay, my husband, like he is super into music and sound. And for him, it transports him to a whole another place. And it’s interesting, and I’m excited to hear more from you is, you know, for me, music was always about the beat. I always just like, you know, I like the beat the beats good. And I never really paid attention to like the words. I mean, just think about things in high school that I dance to, you know, my back or singing in my car, because I like the beat and for Jai and I’m sure for you and what you teach. It’s like it’s just a deeper experience. So talk a little bit about that. Because you know, if it’s about the music and the art, how do we really step in, especially if we’re A types and we’re go go go, how we let go and we listen.
Renata: This is a really great question. So first of all, it is knowing what you gravitate to naturally. Like you tend to write your secretly write your own poetry, well, then maybe you should write, if you love music, and everywhere you go. If you’re someone like Jay who has the music on it really has a connection to that, then that’s where you start. And even if you you know a visual artist, if you kind of sketch in your book, but you sketch kind of quietly, well maybe go a little bigger with that. So for the type A’s, and this is really interesting, and I have seen people, I have seen people and I have seen children that come and they will have a blank piece of paper or a blank canvas, and they cannot make a mark, they can’t do it. Or they will do it and they erase there’s such a fear around doing something incorrectly or that there’s a judgment around it. So I mean, that’s a very hard place to be, I would say, for people that really are struggling with like, actually expressing. Start small, it doesn’t have to be a big grandiose, you don’t have to say I’m going to start painting now every week or I’m going to start you know, recording my own music. Start small it is small things like you know, yes. If you really do like to think do you really do like art, but you haven’t gone there, just quietly draw something, take 10 minutes, draw something, put it in a journal, no one needs to see it burn the page, it doesn’t matter. It’s the process of sitting with that discomfort. I hate to say that there’s value in the discomfort though, if you find that you really are struggling to relax. When you create, the more you do, the more you will start to relax. It’s like that it’s like if you just suddenly decided you’re going to run around the block. If you haven’t actually done that a long time. It feels kind of crummy the whole while right? So but there is value in just keep it simple. keep it really simple, like you know, write a poem, write a two line poem, write a one line poem, it doesn’t matter, then then you know, it’s just bringing that into your life every day in some way, shape, or form. Even a walk around the block. Even that putting on like consciously making the choice to put on inspiring music, and walking or inspiring music and taking some paints and painting something it doesn’t have to be anything like this is another thing I really want people to understand. It doesn’t have to be in terms of visual art, it doesn’t have to be something that looks like something you know, that’s a really strong thing that people sort of are still attached to not everyone that it should look like something I recognize it doesn’t have to I’ve got tons of intuitive art that looks like it’s just where my mood was at in that moment. On that day, and if I was to do if I had the same intention tomorrow, it would look completely different color. If you’re really stuck, just use color. When was the last time you put paint on your fingers. I do it all the time. But paint on a piece of paper and use your fingers to blend it. There’s something beautiful in that because you get that that tactile feeling, you get the chance to be messy. That’s actually really Great for a type A, like, a little bit messy, but kind of controlled messy, right? It’s intriguing, but not like over the top right, scraping into that paint. And even if at the end of your 20 minutes or 10 minutes, it doesn’t look like anything, the experience has shifted something, right. When was the last time you did that, like? So all of that is a value, I think incremental steps. I think what you miss out when you don’t invite creativity in is you, you go to work, or you have work. You have your to do list, and life feels flat.
Jenny: Mm hmm. Yeah.
Renata: I think if you invite creativity in even only incrementally, you start to appreciate and just enjoy the endless possibilities of what that can be for you. Right?
Jenny: What I also took from like all those examples, because I am an A type, but I’m not nearly as rigid as I used to be because I came from corporate America where it was like, sales. Go Go Go, I went sunup to sundown, and I had a blast, but I also like wore myself out doing it. And what you were saying just get in the flow or, you know, paint or dance or whatever that is, it almost reminded me because you said you can use that as a way to relax and almost felt like that’s also could could be a step too, because I feel like sometimes a types they want to meditate. They just don’t know how, and they don’t want to sit there and quote unquote, do nothing. So even just doing these creative things, can maybe even feel that piece of them that feels like they’re doing something, but it’s helping them slow down and and get into that flow and connection in a different way. And it could still count as meditation.
Renata: Yeah, I do definitely meditate. When I paint, there is sort of like a or there’s different definitely a mood shift. Like I, I just kind of lose myself a bit, I find that I sort of am swaying, I lose myself a little bit, that the mental chatter kind of just quiets down. The other component for a type A too is probably you’ll be able to do these things without the guilt.
Jenny: Yeah. Or the or the pressure to be perfect.
Renata: To be perfect. Yeah, it’s interesting. So if the Type A could approach it and the way they approach other things, like I’m going to take my 10 minutes, I’m going to put it in my schedule or my 15 minutes, put it in my schedule, I’m going to do it and regardless of what it looks like at the end, or sounds like at the end, I’ve done it. Yeah. And there is actually a book, I can’t remember the author, it’s at the War of Art, is that right? And he speaks about resistance, and just how overcoming resistance to things is such a huge component to being a creative person. Inviting creativity in right? And resistance comes in many forms, but like it’s not perfect. I don’t know how, right? There’s little voices
Jenny: From my journey, right? From A type to, I’m still gonna always be A type. But like I said, I’ve we say ctfo in our business a lot, which is like chill the fuck out, like I have definitely ctfo quite a bit is, you know, as with what you’re saying, it’s it’s definitely a much more fun experience. Because I feel like everything you’re talking about, and everything that we’re exploring here with the throat chakra, and really stepping into your voice and finding your creativity and finding that flow. It’s like less stress, it’s less pressure, you know, from like my previous A type ways to being in this moment, because I feel like I can invite even more possibilities into my life. Because I’m not so rigid with everything.
Renata: Yes, that you haven’t already sort of pre determined how it should be. Yeah, I think the other thing is to really with the throat chakra is perhaps think of it as those little mini creative moments or more time, if you ended up there, that’s honoring your own internal voice, doing things that you enjoy is honoring your own internal needs your own internal voice, what makes you as an individual, happy, what makes you thrive, right? You don’t thrive by only feeding, doing the things that you don’t love. You may thrive in the 3d world, financially, whatever, right? It may look like you’re thriving, but for the soul to thrive, which sounds you know, maybe sounds a little corny, but for the soul to thrive. You need to participate in things that make you happy. And if you never do that, you will never get there. It’s kind of that simple, right? I mean, it’s those are the these are the steps do those things that and even if people have told you Oh, you can never be a writer! Are you kidding? Do you know how many friends I have now in my 50s who have self published books and you know, are starting businesses or doing new and exciting things. It’s almost like there’s you really are never, it’s never too late.
Jenny: Yeah, and you know, it’s it’s interesting because it’s like even, like you said, doing the things you love, but also remembering that you may love your work. You may love your business. But there are things outside of that. And so I want to explore a little bit more about, you know, this idea. But I wanted to get to this in the beginning, right? You know, you’re, you’re a proudly recovered people pleaser. Okay? Let me add this just because so in our business, we decided to expand and step into the wedding industry with wedding pros. Okay, so you’ve got wedding planners, and photographers and cake and the whole everything, right, DJs and photographers and whatnot. And in that industry, it’s really about pleasing the client. And I think a lot of times, you know, especially if we are perfectionist, or we want to do well, or we want to make sure our business looks good, we can get a little bit into that people pleasing mode. So I am so excited to hear more about like, what that journey was like for you, and how did you recover? What did you do?
Renata: It was a process and a really long one, if I’m honest, for me not to say that it would be for everyone, but, but when it did, click, boy did it click, like. So for me, you know, as I said, my 20s, my teens, my 20s, my 30s are very geared towards what what society would perceive as these are all the things you need to be happy, right? Need to be married, have two kids have a nice home, all of these things, do this, and you’ll be happy, and not really questioning that. And I had a sense of adventure, and I did adventurous things, right? I traveled a lot before and you know, that kind of a life. But then I sort of realized in my 40s, as my mother, my parent, my mom was aging, and it’s just like, I am nurturing everybody. And I’m not doing anything that is nurturing myself. And partly because in my scenario I had grown up, my sister has a physical disability, so an orphan children. This is an interesting piece of information for anyone out there. Often children who have a sibling who has some sort of physical, mental need emotional need, they often learn to take care of their own needs, and often tend to feel that their needs aren’t as significant. So I think I grew up in that kind of an environment where it’s like, just take care of your own needs. And don’t ask for anything, because whatever you’re going to ask for is probably not going to be as important as what somebody else might be Asking for. So it took a long time to unravel that and to realize that, and to kind of get to a point where I had two young kids, I had a husband I had, I was working only part time, but I had an agent parent. And it was like I can’t I’m I’m I’m so tired of making sure everyone else is okay. And it wasn’t that I resented that, but it was this realization that you really only have so much time and energy in a day. And if you never it sounds I know we’ve all heard it. But if you never put it into your own cup, you get tired, you get burnt out, you do start to resent us do start to go, how is it that my life is taking care of everyone else and people pleasing for everyone else, and I feel unfulfilled? Or I feel frustrated. For me it was more like a frustration. How did I resolve it? I think I just got to the point where I realized no one was going to give me what I needed. I kind of had to go and get it or I had to say no to things that were no longer fulfilling for me. I mean, part of it was work as well. I like the saying I was in the graphic design environment. And I learned pretty quickly that the more work you do, and the quicker you are with deadlines, people go, Oh, great, she can do it. And then you find yourself up at four in the morning going why do you always come to me? What? How can you can’t organize your lives enough? Your procrastination is not my problem, right? But yet, you’re being paid as you say you’re in this environment of work. And so you, you constantly are feeding that treadmill of trying to keep other people happy, even though the asks may be too much. Right? And being able to kind of go, is this the life I want. Because the more energy you put into that the more you get, right? So the more you feed that that machine, the more comes out of that machine. So at a certain point for me, I just had to stop and go none of this is fulfilling. I want to be deal more with people. So I moved into teaching art, I was painting on my own sort of quietly doing my thing, and basically made a choice that I was no longer Phil doing that. I’m going to move into teaching art and love that I just loved seeing people come for connection, come for expression. So then the people pleasing shifted for me because I was no longer doing things that I didn’t really love all day every day. I was spending more time doing something that I that felt fulfilling for me. And then once you get there, you can’t go back. Then when somebody says you know i’d really like you to do this, you know annual report like 400 million pages and I’d like it done by tomorrow. You’re like, I don’t think I want to do that. Right? I don’t know, I think that it was that simple for me on some level, even though the process was slow. I think it’s once you feel somewhat filled in what you’re doing in your daily life you love and I do love what I do, then it’s really hard to go back to saying yes to things that you’re like, oh, it pays well, but I don’t love it. But how long is it going to take? Well, three weeks? To not love Yeah, to feel resentful or to? I don’t know, you don’t want to actually do it, but make yourself sit and do it.
Jenny: But what I’m what I’m picking up here, you know, it’s just another way to express what you shared. It’s like tuning into your body and, and you and recognizing, when things feel a certain way that you have the power to decide if you want that feeling or if you want that experience. Yeah, versus going so fast, or not even. It’s almost like conscious living versus unconscious living, like if you’re just on this. You know, you’re just saying yes, left and right. Especially, I mean, I know, for me being in sales prior, it was about money. I was I was hustling for that money. And I don’t, in my experience, there, there’s nothing wrong with that, because it got me to a certain point, but also to I felt like part of the evolution was finding a different driver, not just about money, because I feel like for me my experience, the money was about saying yes to things or doing things because it was like, Yeah, yeah, build, build, build, grow, grow, grow. Yeah. You know, versus like you said, having a nice balance or counterbalance between the two. Yes, you need to get paid well for what you do. But you also need to enjoy and…
Renata: Live your life. Yeah. And I think and you’re absolutely right. And I think I think part of that is age I you know, I want to say that. But I don’t want to say that I want to say that I believe for a lot of people, there’s a certain age and time that has to pass and you have those experiences, and you’re fulfilled, but you’re burning out and you’re tired, or you’re realizing that when you have your free time, you can’t really do anything, because you’re so tired, you kind of almost have to go through that process. To get to the point where you can kind of go, you know what, I’ve been there, done that, and it worked for a bit. But it’s no longer fits. Yeah. And I think that’s okay. And I think the throat chakra is the same idea. Like you get to go through you maybe you go through those experiences where you feel when you’re whatever your culture, your experiences, where I can’t truly Speak up, I can’t truly make a choice. And you do that long enough. And then eventually, hopefully, if you become like our conscious about your point, your body tells you. I’ve had many experiences where my stomach has turned and I’m like, do yeah, don’t say yes. And then you kind of hear your voice go, Yes. No, the body said no. And, you know, there’s an awareness around that. But you know, I think it’s not abnormal to live the contrast, before you reach some level of honoring ability to honor that. Right? And that’s okay. So if you find yourself in that place where like, I really, it’s easy to say, but it’s hard to do. Yeah, it is hard to do. But you have a choice to either do it or you don’t. Right. Like, for example, I have a friend who comes from a culture where women aren’t generally hugely empowered within the family structure, right? And, you know, she’s like, at a certain point, I just have to say no, like, it just has to be no, like, you don’t need to understand or we don’t have to come to some agreement on saying no. So as I know, it’s, it feels really complicated. But if you kind of unpack it, you really only have two choices, you either honor what feels good for you and feels authentic and truthful for you what you really honestly want, or you don’t, and it’s little baby steps, right? You can do it in baby steps, and you gain the confidence. And then the beautiful thing is once you’ve crossed a few of those lines, and you’ve sort of made it through a few experiences where you thought the world might cave in, if you did what you wanted to do, or you said what you wanted to say, then suddenly you’re on fire. Because once you start feeling confident in articulating how you feel creating and expressing without worrying about what the rest of the world thinks of it, then it’s hard to rein that back in. So it’s kind of a really beautiful process if you can trust it.
Jenny: So I have a question. And I’m going to share a little bit about my journey. But I also want to hear how expressive Arts in this creative journey that you bring to the table would play into this type of scenario. So it’s interesting because I feel like there’s, there’s got to be different layers of like awakening or opening up in your throat chakra, about stepping into your voice, right? Because if I look back, you’re like, let’s say 10 years ago when I very first started my journey as a speaker, author, coach. I mean, I was creating content. I was doing all kinds of stuff. I published a book like I had a lot of great stuff, but at the time, I didn’t trust myself. And so I closed it down and kind of went back in the closet and went and hit again, so to speak. And when I look back at that content like, dang, that shit was powerful, right? And then I come back, I was really good stuff. So and then I come to this point, right. And I know for sure that I have more work to do on my throat chakra to really step into, because some of the stuff that you said about you know, there’s still a part of me that worries about what people think about this. Or if I say this, or did I say it well enough? Or was it powerful enough or, and all those things? And I bring that up, because it’s interesting, because I feel like, as a listener listening to this podcast, you could think like, oh, wow, she definitely has found her voice cause she has a podcast. And she’s doing these things, right? Like, you could, you could assume that. And yes, there is a layer of it. Because even if you listen back to the first episode, up to now, I’ve grown, and I’ve kind of stepped more into my power. But what I wanted to hear, right, if someone’s on this journey, and there’s like these different levels of awakening, or opening up, how can we really use what you are so good at what you help people? And I know we touched on a little bit before, but like, how do we kind of take it deeper? Because you’ve got that soul expiration class?
Renata: Yeah, I would say the first thing when you tell me a bit about your journey is what happened that made you pack it in and go back into the closet, as you said, with your content? That would be my first question to you, like, did someone say something? what Something must have shifted that mindset to make you kind of go, you know, maybe this isn’t right, right now, or maybe I don’t want to do this right now, maybe this doesn’t feel good. So I think it is being aware of the messages that you’re given. That’s, that’s part of it. The other part of it is, you know, we are all in these social structures, we are, we’re in a social structure, family structure, and our own internal lens, these are sort of like the three, or you know, our close relationship structures. It’s not a family, but close relationship structures, or social structure that were within wherever, whatever country culture, whatever you’re living, and your own internal lens on all of those, you know, so I look at that, and that’s, I don’t know that it ever truly goes away. Like, I’ll be honest with you, there’s things that I want to do that I’m coming back to that. Could I? And you know, part of me goes, yeah. And then the other part of me goes, are you ready to? So I don’t know that it goes away forever. Like I you know, I think you become more comfortable with it. And I think it becomes more of a backseat thing. Right? in, in, in the sense that it’s not the super loud voice anymore. It’s maybe a quiet voice that goes, you know, should you really be doing a podcast on this? Do you really know enough to do you know it and you kind of go, you know what, I got this, I’m going because I want to, and it will be a value, I think that’s maybe also the other lenses, when you get to that place where you’re questioning. Should I? could I? can I? is what you’re it comes down to intention is what you’re trying to do going to be a value to someone out there. I think that’s a huge component. For me, that’s a huge component. Sometimes it’s not always about me, if I’m struggling with something. So for example, I’m also an artist, and if I sell my art, you know, I it’s taken me a long time to come to this place where sometimes it doesn’t really matter whether I love it. It may be it’s meant for someone out there. And it speaks to them in a way that I not aware of. Right? So I think there’s also the bigger picture of letting go of, yes, your own, what you what you what you need to have in terms of boundaries needs, your way you express love the way you express your joy, all of those things. But then it’s also what does that mean for people outside of you? Did that answer the question? Like in the sense that sometimes overcoming those little voices, it’s important for you to do that, but maybe someone else is going to get even more from you having done that? I think now too often to inspire other people. Right? It gives they we’ve heard all heard this before watching someone else go through the process inspires other people to be brave enough to do the same. Right?
Jenny: Yeah, in the very first question you asked, I knew exactly the answer. And and as I wrote them down here, it was, you’re too young. I got that sometimes, right? Like, oh, you have to have a suit, you have to wear a suit on the front of your book, because that’s how people don’t take credible right. And then the other thing is, I had so much emphasis on external validation of, you know, I felt like I had to make six figures in a very short period of time to prove that I was worse yet, or to prove that what I had was good, or if people weren’t raving fans about what I said. And what’s interesting is when I look back, I had a lot of raving fans, but I did not see the raving fans.
Renata: Yeah, you gave them less credibility than you did the folks that you took to heart the things that probably weren’t complimentary, and you discredited discredited your fans, right? So, elements like things like that, that to me. That’s very That’s a very, that’s not an uncommon everyone, you know, everyone loves external validation, but it can’t always be the driver or in ideally, you can see it for what it is external validation doesn’t mean it’s true. Right doesn’t mean it’s true. Some people can say certain things to you or, you know, give you compliments doesn’t mean that it’s absolutely 100%. True. Yeah. Right. And in the end, you have to turn within to yourself, and kind of kind of know yourself enough to know, you know, what I? Yeah, maybe I do do that. But actually, I know, I’m, I know what my real intention is. And if I reword it, or rework it, it’s the same intention is still there. Right? So yeah, there’s a lot of that’s what I mean, be very, be very aware of why you do what you do. I’m very cautious. Now. I catch myself often rethinking words that I’ve used, like, for example, when we were chatting prior to this podcast, I think the word struggle came at him, I think, I don’t like that word. Because it’s not that that implies is a consistent energy output. That’s not getting anywhere. And that’s not not always true. So be cautious of your words, be cautious of those things that you’re taking in that are societal structures are expectations that maybe don’t fit. And how sad is that right for you? I mean, it’s not abnormal, right? But you have an experience like that, where you’re on a roll, you’re on fire, and then somebody says something to you, and you’re like, Oh, right, I should probably back down a little and be a little quieter. And I bet so that frustrates me. For women in particular. I’ll be honest, right? Because that’s, I think women tend to we not always I’m generalizing, but but I think we’re much quicker to pack it in and kind of go Oh, yeah, I’ve upset somebody somebody didn’t like it. I’m gonna, I’m gonna put that away for a bit.
Jenny: Yeah, right. Going back to that people pleasing that we talked about before
Renata: Back to that people pleasing yet staying in that safe zone, because somebody, somebody went, I’m uncomfortable.
Jenny: Yeah, right. Well, and what I love about what we talked about before is that exploration because, you know, I feel like what you said, it’s like these baby steps and really doing that intuitive art or doing that play session, or whether you whether you work through someone like you, right and you hire someone like you when you go to a course like yours, or like you said you do it on your own or both. Just like that, like you said, that blank slate where whether you use your fingers, you just kind of paint whatever comes up with no judgment. And I love what you said, too, because I think something really powerful is trusting that there is a shift, and there will be a shift taking place. Because I’ve been going through a lot of a lot of different courses and work as it relates to mindset. And one of the things that Marissa Pierre says is, it’s like your mind what you say to your mind, your mind will listen, right? Yes. So you are saying like, let’s say you go into the situation, you’re like, well, this isn’t gonna work. This is stupid. This intuitive work.
Renata: Yes, and it is interesting. Because now so for example, with dance right now like this, I can dance I say dance movement, I’m going to explore movement, because I realized, after having done a workshop, a little workshop, you know, that I attended. I was like,man, I, I, I have never thought of that as a form of movement or exercise for myself. And yet, I used to do that and loved it as a kid. And, and same thing. It was like, well, this is unreal. What do you do with this? After a certain age? Nothing, it’s of no value. So it fell off the board, right? But now, as I look at it again, I’m thinking, But when was the last time I moved freely in my body without the internet, like I am working out? I am running, I am exercising, I am like, like, you’re in this thing? 24 hours a day and to come to some sort of peace with it. Enjoy with it. It seems like such an unusual, it seems like that. I don’t know. People that are movers, I do yoga and all that. But people that are movers in that way, I feel is very different than like, Okay, I’m going to the gym. Yeah. It’s a very different mind set. So I’m exploring that. Do I am I good at this? No,I’m terrible.
Jenny: You know, as you were saying that I was reminded to experience I was reminded so clearly we work with an intuitive business coach. And she has said to me, I don’t know, probably 100 times multiple, because I’ve worked with her a lot over the years. And we’re working with her right now. When you were saying it just reminded me one time she told me your guides, I can see your guides, grabbing your body and shaking your hips. And she said you need to just move and shake your hips, you know, like yeah, like she has told me this multiple times. But I had yet to fully embrace it. So right, Miss Renata
Renata: And so why is that? Right? So I’m going to ask why is that is that feels weird. It feels like a waste of time. What am I getting out of this? Right? Those are probably all the sort of little voices going through like oh, that’s silly. That’s silly. So apart. expressive arts therapy is also learning to play again. Yeah. Sounds really funny. Like, it sounds when I say that learning what does that mean? adults can become we become quite restricted like, Okay, well, let’s, let’s get down to business and it’s like, okay, that’s fine. You know, there are times for that. But there’s also got to be some time to lighten up and have a bit of fun. Like, really, truly invite some fun in. So for you, I would say, find two or three songs and wait two days out of the house and dance. And see how that feels. And it’s funny if you can put aside that voice. Like he said, that says this is not productive. But think of it as this is tending to that part of you that, you know, you could say inner child that needs to have a little bit of fun. You could say that part of you that just needs to be not so structured. This is okay. So if you’re an openly open openly admitted type A, this is this is exploring that other side of you. Yeah. Oh, yeah. That’s it, Jenny that doesn’t maybe have all the answers, but doesn’t need to come up with a solution right now, that can actually just float and be free and have a new experience. Right, right. And that’s it, and then you leave going, that’s kind of fun. You know, and it doesn’t need to be more than that. But it’s it, it incrementally opens that door to just being okay with a new experience and not having to have it. That word productive is very, a bit of a dangerous zone, right? Because you don’t you know, really, do you really want to be with someone who’s productive all the time. It can be tiring.
Jenny: It can be and I mean, that kind of yourself. Yeah, that’s kind of in my life. And even just so we had friends in town last week, and we did get some work done. And we did, like, do some things. But we were also out playing with them a lot. And it was fun. And on Sunday, I took him to the airport Monday morning on Sunday, I said to Jai, I was like, Alright, we got to get down to business tomorrow, we got to get shit done. And then Monday was a complete. I mean, Monday was like, I couldn’t do anything Monday. And it was interesting. I was like no words I used on Sunday to set the intention. And then I literally resisted every part of getting to work. On Monday, I was tired, I need a nap. I felt very disconnected. And so this is like the energetic journey I’ve been going through. And that’s what’s so cool about what you shared about just, you know, just do it. And it’s another reminder, and I think this this podcast episode and talking about the throat chakra and really stepping into our power, you know, and and embracing our voice and embracing who we are and, and really like owning our shit, right? Like owning it. Yeah. And that journey, you’re a powerful reminder, to remember to stay in play and stay in flow and explore expressiveness.
Renata: Yes, expressing this. And to your point, like, that’s a great example. You know, you overdid it on the weekend, you had all these plans. And then Monday, your body was just like, I really don’t, I don’t have the focus anymore. Your mind is like, I don’t have the focus and your body’s like, I’m just done. And to honor that, right. And it doesn’t mean that I know, we all have things to do. I’m not saying you know, I’m not not aware of that. I am very aware of that. But the reality is, you know, what did you really have to do that day? What really had to be done? What could wait till the next day, if everything inside of you body and and your own body was saying, not today, please? Yeah, I need to catch my breath, I need to take in instead of output, right? I need to bring something in whether that’s, you know, your by the sea, you know, whether that’s, you know, sitting by the ocean, and just, you know, catching your breath, taking some deep breaths along the walk, taking in some good quality, energy versus output, output, output, output, output, output output, and then wondering why suddenly you just feel, you know, like, no more, right, like, yeah, yeah, it’s true. So it’s that balance, right? For sure.
Jenny: So okay, so we’ve we’ve covered so many things we have covered like everything. And I’m excited because you know, another takeaway I had right there, as you said, like, output output output, or in that moment, is that a perfect time to really step into something expressive?
Renata: Yes, well, no, I take the moment of Earth. It’s like, it’s almost like, to me visually, it’s like the gears grind and stuff. Like it’s just not you just can’t do it anymore. And I’d say that’s the moment to breathe. breathing. So breathing is an example of movement, right? We don’t consider it that. But just breathing, no catch, your breath gets settled. Because sometimes when you’re constantly output output output, the mind then quickly, quickly follows right like if it didn’t initiate it, the mind will quickly go well, but you’re not but you’re not but you’re not but you’re not but you’re not doing this, you’re not doing that. And so the mind will keep that pattern that energy pattern essentially will keep going. And you have to be able to bring yourself back to so I’d say Walking for me, I walk fast. If I’m like, feeling that first thing I will do now is put on my coat and walk fast. Because I know I’m breathing. And I’m moving. And I feel like it’s almost like tricking myself, I’m being productive, I’m getting, I’m getting fresh air I’m, but I’m really actually shifting a bit of energy. Yeah, I’m actually getting some of that agitation, and out, and that edge, you know, that sort of busy edge you have where you can’t shut your mind off. And then after that, you’ve done that, like after you’ve kind of shifted, that’s whether maybe that’s a jog, maybe that’s breathing really deeply and like exhaling through the mouth. That to me, that works for me, like breathing in deeply through the nose and exhaling and making a sound through the mouth. So there’s an example of sound and movement. And, and with the intention of I want to calm down, I want to, I want to soften softens a better word, right? I want to soften the way I feel. And then ideally, yeah, you can certainly move into Visual Art, or you could move into putting on music and even swaying like, Okay, fine. You know, maybe I just, I’m kind of agitated, but maybe I’ll start dinner and put some music on. And it doesn’t have to be this hugely formal thing. I think that’s really important for people to know that I know, we all want this structured, perfect window to do these things. But sometimes, if that’s not available to you, then then take what you can work with what you’ve got, if you’ve got to make dinner, for example. And you know, it’s not looking like in the next day or two, you’re going to get any moments to yourself, put some music on and try and be mindful and stay present in that moment. Because that helps to calm you remembering that, you know, your mind will tell you everything’s gonna fall apart. If you don’t get everything done right now, the reality is it’s probably not. Yeah, it’s probably not. And if you take an hour, two hours to just calm yourself down, when you sit to do it, you might actually be more productive. If we’re going to go back to that where you will, your energy will be more focused. I that’s that’s a better way to say it. Right? Because if you come from a place of already feeling agitated, generally, it takes a lot longer to get something done with any kind of clarity.
Jenny: Yeah, no, I love it. And I know that there. Like I said, there’s been so many aha ‘s. So for sure, there are people listening, who were like, Oh, my God, I love this, I need this. I want to figure out how to do more of this. And I like Renata, like I like her energy. And I want to take this to the next level, like where do they find you? What do you offer? Do you offer virtual services?
Renata: I do. Everything is on zoom. Right now. Right now I currently work with community groups, like I work with the seniors group around social isolation, I’m working with some at risk youth. So I do work with groups. And that’s all on zoom. I do work with individuals for private sessions as well. And then I do offer my painting from the soul that next one will be starting in April. I haven’t determined the date yet. But that will be starting in April. And that’s usually specifically Saturday mornings, early, like 9:30 or something like that just before. So it’s almost like you’ve packed away the week. And now we start right like I mean,
Jenny: 9:30 East Coast time and the United States. Canada, United States. Yep.
Renata: Yeah. And so that’s intentional, so that the rest of you and I’ve had ladies say to me, you know I did that class. I never I was always nervous about what art is going to create. I had one lady said to me, I’m always nervous. I’m always nervous. And then I get there. And I’m totally relaxed. And I have the best weekend. I like I had latency. I have the best days, the days we do art, because you’re starting your day off. giving yourself permission to be a kid like to work with color to work with paint. Anyway. So my website is Renata Chubb art. So R E N A T A C H U B B. Art AR T. And so I have I have a few classes and I do privates. And I do community work as well. So awesome.
Jenny: Yeah, so here’s a resistance that came up that Saturday. Sounds good. But I don’t want to buy all the paint and stuff. Right? So I’m sure you have an answer for that.
Renata: I do that is just resistance. But you know, that’s that’s okay, too. Like I would ask you then to buy literally a blue a yellow or red. So the primary colors plus a black and white, a pad of paper and a few dollar store paint brushes. You don’t need a lot. We don’t have to go out and buy a whole big mega kit. Right? That’s not the that’s not the goal you You don’t need all of that. Like we’ve been doing it on paper because I find I find often people when they’re using paper as opposed to Canvas doesn’t mean can’t move to Canvas. Of course you can. But I ask people to bring heavy paper because people are more relaxed with paper paper as soon as you put it canvass a friend, some people are like, Oh, well, I have to make something that I’m gonna hang on my wall, right? So we want to not go there, right we want people to feel free. So paper and literally be primary colors, black and white and a few paint brushes. That’s all you need. And honestly, we use our fingers, we use the barbecue skewers, we use old gift cards to scrape paint with. And remember what the intention is it’s just to get in touch with yourself again and then so with for example, that chakra painting class, we then sit with that those thoughts for the week. So if we were doing the throat now for the rest of the week, you would sit with really try and take note of when you don’t speak up when you feel you should or where you think you have a boundary but you’re too afraid to say or, and try and carry that for the week. And then the opposite of that of that you are allowed. You are allowed you have the right to you’re allowed to say and articulate things as long as they’re not, you know, openly hurtful towards someone else. You are allowed to say you know what today? I don’t feel like working. I had a long, heavy weekend. I think I need actually a walk by the ocean. You’re allowed to do that.
Jenny: I love it. And this is I mean, I hope that you guys reach out to her and make time for this. And if you don’t I hope that you make time for it in your own life because this has been such a powerful episode a powerful kickoff to the throat chakra. You know, thank you for being a guest. Thank you guys for listening. And we will see you on the next episode. Thank you for listening to the Life Adventurist Podcast. If you love this episode, remember to subscribe on your favorite podcast app. For Course Information freebies and to stay connected join our ohana that means family at www.2jholla.com/ohana. Remember to stay positive, enjoy the journey and most of all, keep those eyes open for all of the adventures surrounding you.