If there is one thing we can all take away from 2020, it is that there is a lot of growth that still needs to happen and a lot of changes that still need to be made. Being in an interracial relationship, Jenny and Jai have experienced first hand the effects of certain things coming to light this year. In this episode, Jenny admits her uncertainty of what is right or wrong to say and Jai explains the importance of asking questions in order to learn. You will never know what is going on in another person’s life until you walk a day in their shoes.

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Jenny: Wap, wap, wap, wap. That’s the sound my dog’s tail makes when it’s hitting something, get your mind out of the, it mean what you think it means. Yes, yes, yes. Yes. You are listening to the holistic life podcast. I’m Jenny!

Jai: I’m shopping on Amazon.

Jenny: His name is Jai. He totally checked out because of the intro. I get it. All right. So with today’s topic, This has the potential to be very raw. No, cause I’m feeling like, Hey, because look, today’s topic is X-factor is the category category is X factor. Oh my God. And then something dumb, like I picked something, you know, like this sound like a game show.

So today we’re going to talk about what it’s like to be in an inner racial relationship. So if you didn’t really pay attention to the podcast cover, like, let’s just say, you know, let’s just say you, listen, you really pay attention. You’re like, Oh cool. He’s jumping. Like it’s, you know, it’s kinda hard to tell if you’ve never looked us up at all.

I’m the white girl. I’m gonna let you explain who you are.

Jai: Oh, I think it’s self-explanatory. I’m the guy jumping.

Jenny: He’s the guy jumping on the white girl. He’s a black guy. Okay. So. I don’t really know where to start with this because for me being in an interracial relationship, marriage, whatever, honestly, sometimes I don’t really notice, like he’s just Jai, I don’t look over and be like.

Jai: Oh, all right. So I mean, with that being said, and this is a recap 2020. Well, yeah, go ahead. Your point of view from like, when, what is it called? No, that’s not where I can’t talk. I was thinking about the word, the racial injustice with what has happened so far in 2020 and how that kind of opened your eyes.

Jenny: Yeah. Wow. It’s hard to recap. Cause it’s so much and. I don’t even think I can completely recap everything and even do it justice, because as I started off saying, like, sometimes I don’t realize that we’re in an interracial marriage because he’s just Jai. And what’s interesting is with everything that came up this year with the civil unrest and with all the demonstrations and the marches and the protests and everything.

Right. And social media blown off with everybody. You know, saying everything cause that’s 2020, everybody just speaking their mind openly with no, whatever the fuck they want to say. You know, one of the things is like, I know for example, someone may be listening and be like, Oh, you don’t even notice your husband that he’s black.

Like, that’s one of the things that’s really important and that makes him really special. So that’s very, it’s not okay to be colorblind because recognizing him and his blackness is what’s makes him him and what’s important. And so I get that, but at the same time, you know, from my perspective, I just feel like Jai’s Jai.

You know, like I don’t think every day and wake up everyday. Like, Oh my God, I’m in an interracial relationship. Like it, it just, we’re two people. We’re two humans. We’re two people who love each other and go about life. Now with that being said, I remember when everything first started. Not first started.

I’m not going back back, back to the beginning. I’m talking about this year when everything really was ramping up and Jai and I were talking, he was like noticeably upset. And we had a lot of conversations and really just understanding like, okay, what is this for you? And I think the biggest thing was for me realizing and recognizing one, that there are some problems when it comes to equality and race.

Number two. I thought one a, I guess is like, I thought a lot of that was in the past. I couldn’t believe that it was still like here. Number two, is that Jai and many other African-Americans and people of color have been experiencing this and very aware of all of these struggles for many, many years. And for me, I was like, Like, Oh, wow.

I didn’t pay attention to any of the other times. They didn’t really pop up on my radar and never, they weren’t on my radar and these all were on my radar. So we really talked through everything and he shared a lot of that with me. And we watched a lot of documentaries and movies and just shared a lot and it’s really eyeopening.

And to be honest, like I’m trying to find the right words because. I’m a white girl. So I feel like in this moment it’s like, Oh, you’re a privileged white person. So I feel like I might say the wrong thing, or I said something incorrectly or I’m showing how privileged I am or showing how insensitive I am.

Like, I’m really afraid, especially on this format to say the right or wrong thing. And. It’s kind of hard. Like, I don’t like that you asked that question, but I guess that’s really the point of this podcast, what it’s like to be in an interracial relationship.

Jai: Yup. And this is our platform, so you shouldn’t feel, and I mean, people are going to say what they want to say anyway.

But you know where your position is, you know, where you stand.

Jenny: Sometimes I’m not good at articulating it. I got to get better at that. Like sometimes really articulating like my beliefs in stance on the spot. I don’t always do very well with that when it comes to like deeper issues. That I really just, you and I talk about, but like in a public forum or in a sense like this, like I sometimes struggle with articulating it and especially with something sensitive like this, I don’t, I don’t want to say the wrong thing.

I don’t want to offend somebody. And of course, I mean, if I do say something offensive, I want, I want to know so that I can make it better…

Jai: but with everything that’s been going on though, like I honestly feel some people. Offend, you know what I’m saying? Like, I feel there’s a lot of things that have been taken out of context.

I feel that a lot of things have been brought to the light, if you will, or have, have been made aware of some things I feel have been totally blown out of proportion. Like certain words you can or can’t say because it’s cultural appropriation. I mean that has been done across the board. Across the board.

So like people who have Asian tattoos, what are you saying? Like, I can’t get the Chinese symbol for love on my back because it’s cultural appropriation and I’m not an Asian person. So I feel that’s just an example. I feel some things have been totally, totally blown out of proportion.

Jenny: Well, and even to listening with the awareness I have now, I even wonder if you said that correctly, cause you shared, I can’t get the Chinese symbol on my back because I’m not an Asian person. I would wonder if that’s even the right. See, that’s not a Chinese symbol.

Jai: That’s what I’m saying. When I say that people understand what I’m talking about. Without me having to run to a book and say like, Oh my God, I’m offended because it’s not Asian. It’s Japanese, it’s Korean. It’s it’s whatever you, you get my point.

Jenny: Yeah. I don’t know. I mean, I’m sitting here wondering, I’m like, I’m even afraid to ask questions because this is so like, Charged, you know? Cause I like, I don’t want to be the idiot white girl who’s privileged. She was asking the wrong thing.

Jai: But if you don’t ask the questions, how will you learn?

Jenny: Because I’m like, what does this have to do with being an interracial relationship? And there’s a part of me that knows that has everything to do because obviously when you’re married to someone who’s a person of color or you’re dating someone who’s person of color, or if there’s a person of color in your family, It’s everything.

Jai: Right? So let’s, let’s take it out of the scope of black and white.

You know what I’m saying? Let’s, let’s take it into scope of, of, and I don’t even know if I’m saying this right. And I’m probably going to get ripped or trolled because I have offended somebody’s inner religious relationships. Yeah.

Jenny: I’m saying, I mean, okay. So here’s where I kind of go, like, as you say that now that we’re kind of trying to be PC with these words, it just is kind of like.

Isn’t that just that’s every relationship and that to a certain degree, like not every, but I feel like it’s a lot of relationships that are either interracial, two people from two different races, two different backgrounds, and a lot of times to different religions. I know there’s a lot of people of same race and same religion who get together too.

But I feel like you threw that in, that’s like freaking 80% of the world probably.

Jai: Well, okay. If you’re talking about somebody who is. Christian Christian, not just like, Oh, I grew up Christian, but do you know, they’re well rooted in their Christian beliefs who marry somebody who’s well-rooted in their Islamic Muslim beliefs.

You know what I’m saying? It’s I feel the flip side of the same coin, you know, but you, you still have to deal with customs the stuff you deal with that particular religion and this particular religion under the same household. So yes, it is 80% of the world. But if you look at it from like, because you grew up Christian, I grew up Baptist, neither one of us really go to church.

So yes, you have those people, but I’m talking about people who, who are well rooted in their religious beliefs.

Jenny: I see what you’re saying, but I would say I. Because this is something you just kind of brought up. I haven’t had a chance to really like, think about it, but I guess there are similarities to be in an interracial relationship and difference in religion. But like, I feel like with the example you brought up. It’s not quite the same, because I feel like with religion, there’s some like deep beliefs. If you are like a practicing Muslim or a practicing Catholic or whatever, and you marry someone who’s not practicing that religion, I feel like that goes deeper and beliefs versus you’re black and I’m white. I don’t feel like there’s like these foundational beliefs that clash.

Jai: How do you feel when you walk through a neighborhood with bars on a window?

Jenny: With bars on the windows. I am uncomfortable because I’ve been taught that that usually means that there’s bad people in that.

Jai: So how does that not go hand in hand with the religious it’s the same type of thing you grew up in certain beliefs.

Jenny: Yeah, but it’s beliefs..I don’t know. Cause if I’m practicing Catholicism or I’m practicing Christianity or I’m practicing Muslim or whatever.

Jai: Aren’t you still practicing those same beliefs when you…

Jenny: so that comes up once a, whatever comes up versus like, if you’re practicing this religions, it’s a lot more in your life because now you’re talking about holidays and days off of school and that feels like a lot more integrated.

Jai: I walked you through the neighborhoods I grew up in where I feel totally comfortable. But because you didn’t grow up in that, it’s, uh, a lack of understanding because you’re not comfortable.

Jenny: Okay. Let’s put it this way. Yes. Generally speaking, but as we’ve gone through a relationship at this point, I would still be nervous, but I would be much more comfortable than I would have been two or three years ago.

Jai: My whole point is it’s similar. So that was a long route to get to. You should be scared to talk about this on our podcast.

Jenny: Thank god, we’re not talking about religion. Cause I was like, man, I’m not ready to go there, but I get it. I get it. Because like what you just brought up. I mean, yeah. I mean, well, how do you feel? How do you feel about 2020 and being an interracial relationship? I’m going to turn the question you asked me back on you.

Jai: It’s challenging when stuff like that comes, comes up and you don’t fully understand the, the trauma, the baggage, if you will. That, that comes along with it being 2020 and having parents, grandparents, great grandparents who lived through something that some aspect of the world thinks it doesn’t exist. You know what I’m saying? To know that my great grandparents or someone who could have been my great grandparents were harassed for, for sake of a lighter word, not even that long ago. If you were a darker color, you couldn’t do certain things.

And to be in a situation where you didn’t previously grasp the, the depth of the civil rights movement or civil rights period, or the Tuskegee project or black wall street or…

Jenny: Right, a lot of things I hadn’t heard of.

Jai: Right. Or seeing, uh, weren’t aware..

Jenny: I wasn’t aware of the depth of the details.

Jai: 14:50 Right. It’s difficult to, to think, you know, this is 2020, I’m 40. I shouldn’t have to be afraid like my grandparents were. You know, to know that this shit is still going on and to be in a situation to watch this shit happen, like in the news, you know what I’m saying? And, and, and hearing people’s different responses and, and people’s lack of responses and to have to deal with all these emotions coming up and for my wife to ask me, how can I help?

Fuck. I don’t know. Yeah. I don’t even know how to help myself right now.

Jenny: Do you think that me, or if we go like more global, do you think that someone who’s not a person of color who’s married to a person of color could ever understand?

Jai: No.

Jenny: Yeah. I don’t. I don’t either. And I can empathize. I can learn, you know, and honestly too, I mean, you do hear other.

Racists say, well, I’ve been through different levels of discrimination, et cetera, et cetera. But. I don’t feel like I could ever fully understand what it’s like and it’s definitely heartbreaking to hear your stories or stories of our other friends who have been frisked for just walking around town or stopped or feared, you know, getting pulled over for speeding or something and feared their life or feared their safety, you know, just getting pulled over and, and kind of being pushed around or the stories of the white people that we’ve heard who were with black people and the cops saying, Oh, are you okay?

You know, white person, white, mostly a white girl. Are you okay? Is he hurting you here? I’ll let you go. You know, I know, I know you both have a huge bag of whatever drug in your car, but white girl, I’ll let you go home. You go home, you go safe. Don’t do it again. And then the black person gets thrown in jail and…

Jai: …and by like all means, I’m not trying to make this a racial thing.

I’m talking about like Jewish people, you know, who were persecuted Asian people. Even women, the, the pride community, you know, just like you would never understand, like I would never understand the persecution. That they’ve been through as well. So I’m just not, definitely not talking about a black thing for our listeners.

Who’s like, Oh my God, here we go. No, I’m talking about all people of all nationalities, all, all types out there, the discrimination and just us being people and trying to understand, trying to empathize. You can never, you can never fully experience or understand that unless you are living in that other person’s shoes.

Jenny: So there’s, there’s two things that I want to bring up as it relates to being in an interracial relationship. One of the things is. You know, we’ve been talking about taking like, uh, you know, being nomads and taking this trip, you know, around the US and just going where the wind blows us. And as a white person, I just go where I want to go, you know?

And you stay out of unsafe places, but Jai said to me recently, we were talking about this, like, yeah, that sounds good. Just we may need to do some extra research to make sure that wherever we’re going, you know, is okay or friendly. I don’t remember your exact words, but basically like they’re okay with black people, you know, I don’t want to go to a really racist town.

We need to make sure we’re not going to places like that and never, ever, ever in my life. Did I ever think I would be researching to see, to make sure a town was safe for me and my husband to go to. And I think, unfortunately, that’s the reality. Now the rainbow and butterfly side of me wants to believe there’s no way that would happen. And maybe the naive side of me too, but I’m like, man, we’re going to be fine like Jai is such a cool dude, you know, but there are obviously situations out there that. We would not be welcome for whatever reason. So I don’t even know how to research that. What do I put, like if we’re going to go to Mabuufoo, Georgia, whatever someplace we’ve never heard.

Cause we were like, Oh, there’s a cool Airbnb there, look at this cool cabin in the woods, whatever. Not like, you know, nothing like scary movie stuff, but whatever. It’s like a cool place in the mountains, whatever. I mean, what do I do? Go to Google and go is Mamboofu. Racist. Like, I don’t even know, probably answer you.

Yeah. So anyways, like I just don’t even know how to do that. And even I’ve thought to, like, if we travel around the world and go places, you know, Eastern Europe that are predominantly white and I go with my black husband, is he going to be welcomed? Are we going to be welcomed? Like I really don’t know.

And the fact that I have to think about that and consider that being in an interracial relationship honestly blows my mind. And so when he asked what’s 2020, like that, that is the thing, like, I can’t believe that 2020, where we’re at right now is still, there’s a point where you have to think about these things.

And that was my awakening that this is still taking place. And a lot of people are still being prejudice. That’s not even the right term. It’s the right term, but not the right tense prejudice. Just about, you know, like against like people are still being. Whatever that word is like, they’re like being hated because of who they are.

And it’s interesting. Cause the other part of that is remembering some of my travels and my history and my past and stuff and, and remembering and being aware of that. Some of the words that were being used towards groups of people, because I know in England, they really don’t like one certain group of people.

And I really don’t want to remember the name of what they called him, but it was a very like, Hateful derogatory name. So they just hated all that one group of people and would always talk shit about him. I think that’s the thing that kind of breaks my heart. And I’m still baffled by, I can’t believe that I’m going to have to research if a town is racist and if my husband’s going to have.

Jai: I was also a cool dude walking through Costco and who had the police waiting for him when he was on his way out.

Jenny: I know that. Even though I had my awakening. I’m still baffled by it. I still can’t believe leave that that’s the case because yes. And going back to what I said at the beginning, like, yes, I honor. And I see your color. I see your race. I see your heritage. I see your culture. I see you in the beauty for all that you are, but at the same time, we’re all humans.

Like I’m not any different. We all have dreams. We all have goals and dreams and things that we want to do, be an accomplished in life. We all have things that we want to experience. And so honestly, like, besides like I’m just in the basic, basic, right, Jai, you’re not any different than me. You’re a human being with a heart.

You’re human being with a soul. You’re a human being, you know, with a brain. And you’re a human being just like I am. The only difference is, is that you’re male and I’m female. And that your skin is a different color than mine. And then potentially if you had been born in a different country, right. Like your culture or something, so, okay.

That’s one thing. Is there any comments you want to make on that? The second thing that I wanted to bring up was I’ve been asked, especially this year, I’ve been asked a lot. Oh, you know, what’s it like being, you know, in a relationship together, do you have people who have harassed the two of you or stared at you or been mean, et cetera, et cetera.

And I personally, to this point am grateful to say that not that I’ve been aware of, I have not witnessed any hate or anything come our way, but doesn’t mean people haven’t looked at us weird or scowled us or scoffed at us. I just haven’t noticed it, which I think is good because honestly, I don’t want that energy in my realm.

They can think whatever they want, you know, I’m sure… God, I can only imagine to the other people, interracial couples get this right. They get these scoffs and these looks and these whatevers, and sometimes I’m sure even worse. I would only think too that someone who is in a same-sex relationship or who is transgender or non-binary or any of those things, getting the scoffs and scowls and looks.

And just because you’re different, just because you don’t follow what everybody else does. Like, it’s just ridiculous. Honestly, I just, what do you think, like, have you noticed anything?

Jai: Nah.

Jenny: We’re grateful that we haven’t noticed anything, but also we’ve lived in places that are pretty diverse. Right? You think about Houston, Houston’s pretty diverse when you’re in a big city like that.

There’s ton of NBC’s here and I’m not saying like hatred and racial profiling and stuff doesn’t happen here. It’s just way more diverse than if we were in a Ross or Oceana Ohio, which is like Western Cincinnati. And it’s definitely different there. Totally different, not the whole area. I’m sure there’s nice people, right?

If you’re listening and you’re from those areas, if you’ve ever heard of them, but it is different right than the big city. It’s a lot more country, boys and girls who miss an area near where I grew up. And I heard a lot, a lot, a lot, a lot, a lot of racist comments as a, as a kid, towards black people and people of color.

Lots and even two against the Mexicans, I guess Mexicans fall on the people of color too, but specifically blacks and Mexican. Oh, I heard all kinds of racist comments growing up. So that’s why I call out that area because I know for sure it exists even more there in the open, but yeah, no, we’ve been living in Florida where we do it’s pretty diverse as well.

So we don’t. Experience it like day in and day out. So I’m going to set the intention for that to continue to remain the case for us, that we don’t experience any firsthand hate or violence because we’re in an interracial relationship. If someone wants to say something, they’re welcome to say something, but I don’t have to entertain it. We can just walk away.

Jai: It’s interesting too, because I’ve seen people who were like, you know, why would you date outside your race or whatever. And I guess that falls into like any category, but…

Jenny: Ooh, I didn’t even think about that. Like black women getting mad at black men for not dating a black woman. Or dating guy, girl, girl, not dating.

Jai: I’m just saying, or a black woman dating a white guy goes both ways or whatever. Right. But I mean the coolest thing…

Jenny: Or a black woman dating a white woman…

Jai: is, is who makes you okay. All your boxes are checked Jen. We’re good. Got it. No, it’s okay. I was going to say different, but it’s a chance to, to grow, to learn, to see something outside of your, of what you’re used to first time hanging out with your family.

That was interesting. Cause I had my perceptions and getting to know them and realizing, like you said earlier, You know, we’re just all people, it really doesn’t matter, but your family has done some stuff where I’m like, ah, what the fuck is this shit? Okay. This is interesting. This is cool. Or whatever, and just learning…Um, the dynamics of that.

Jenny: What is funny, what I love to do is like, when we’re doing stuff or whatever, cause I know, look, I know why people are funky and uncoordinated. And w…

Jai:… what do you mean by funky? Like paraphrase that..

Jenny: No, not funky, like black people funk soul, like funky, like dorks, not all of them, but just, you know, black people or white people can be.

Jai: I thought you meant funky like stinky.

Jenny: I’m sure some of them do. I don’t know. There’s lots of people in the world that stink, but no, I mean, just white people just can be really like uncoordinated and whatnot, you know? So it’s funny. I love what I love doing with you. Isn’t it? When you start laughing at something I’m like, wait, is that WPS?

Jai: I mean, I feel that’s one of those stereotypes though. Like, cause I’ve been watching a lot of videos lately on Tik TOK. Where I like the dancing videos on Tiktok and a lot of the videos I watch black people. Right.

Jenny: Right. Of course. There’s lots of like white people that have. Rhythm and can dance for sure. Right. But stereotype, that’s what I find. That’s what I enjoy like doing, like when we’re doing something, especially driving 17 hours, you know, listen to the radio or whatever, like songs come on that Jai’s never heard of.

And I’m like, yeah. Is this song a WPS or was it just that your family didn’t listen to this? So it was always kind of fun doing kind of this conversation. If you don’t know what WPS is, it’s white people shit. Like, you know, like the top three corny ass songs that are played at white people weddings, like they would probably never be played at a black person’s wedding…

Jai: What is it? Journey.

Jenny: Yeah, don’t stop believing. Number one, everything is fucking nuts. I could not see that being played at like a Latino wedding or like..

Jai: sweet Caroline.

Jenny: Oh my God. Yeah. There’s like, there’s just this a couple that are just anyway…

Jai: … but not knocking those songs because they do jam. Just not on my heavy rotation, right?

Jenny: Nor would it be at your wedding or like any of your family’s wedding or anything? Right. Totally not maybe at home by yourself, random.

Jai: Maybe if it just happens to be in what the playlists I was listening to at the time.

Jenny: Right. Well, I’m sure there’s so much more we could talk about. I don’t even know how long this has been. I could peek and look, but it’s facing the other way. I know that. No matter what, for me, I’ve always had a love for all people from everywhere. I’ve always had a genuine interest and just a passion to meet people from all over the world, hear their stories, understand where they come from, understand honor, who they are, have always been intrigued by that.

And so it just so happens that the man who’s with me in life is a person of color, just so happens. He could have been anybody for me. It’s his heart soul. It’s it’s who he is. That shines the brightest for me. It’s the thing that I love the most…

Jai: Sweet Caroline, bah bah baaaah.

Jenny: Oh my God. Please stop.

All right guys, you know that we would love to hear from you. We would love to connect with you. Our last episode, we invited you to join our Ohana, but we didn’t really tell you how to do that. So if you want to join our Ohana and get our cool weekly Aloha updates, then go to the number two J forward slash Ohana.

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I don’t know it’s who I am. Obviously, if we take a picture of his back it must be who I am. All right, Jai’s done. If you can’t tell he is done and out for the count. So that means this episode is over thanks for listening. Bye. You can subscribe to the holistic life podcast from your favorite streaming platform.

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